Masonic Forum Home Search Members Calendar Who's On Welcome Guest ( Login | Register ) Recent PostsRecent Posts Popular TopicsPopular Topics Home » General » The Appendant Degrees and Orders » How deep is the HRA 16 posts, Page 1 of 212»» How deep is the HRA Rate Topic Display Mode Topic Options Author Message whistlerwhistler Posted 27/11/2009 23:49 Apprentice Group: Forum Members Last Login: 20/07/2010 08:48 Posts: 71, Visits: 304 It is good not to consider the Masonic Origins of this degree, but to look with care at the symbols within - Is it a story of a people on a Journey as some Masonic writers suggest? Look at the Hebrew Letters within the HRA - and remember that Hebrew is the oldest language still in use today - as we seek the hidden mysteries of our craft surely we will find some signposts in the HRA HGW Whistler Eastern order of International Co-freemasonry Auckland New Zealand "Truth All truths are Truths of Period and not truths for eternity. What has been truth for the time was and is as good as men are capable of receiving Post #15900 cuthbertcuthbert Posted 28/11/2009 01:41 Apprentice Group: Forum Members Last Login: 02/12/2009 20:20 Posts: 59, Visits: 212 whistler (27/11/2009)It is good not to consider the Masonic Origins of this degree, but to look with care at the symbols within - Is it a story of a people on a Journey as some Masonic writers suggest? Look at the Hebrew Letters within the HRA - and remember that Hebrew is the oldest language still in use today - as we seek the hidden mysteries of our craft surely we will find some signposts in the HRA I recently took the HRA and I enjoyed it a lot, I found it very esoteric and deep...IMO it's not the story of a travel but the story of the descovery of something that was lost long time ago. Unfortunately, they dropped the second holy word, that I considered very important from a esoteric point of view, I would have liked to be exalted with the original ritual, but they told me that this wasn't possible. Post #15908 Russell HollandRussell Holland Posted 28/11/2009 02:30 Fellow Group: Forum Members Last Login: Today @ 11:54 Posts: 246, Visits: 1,522 HRA shows signs of Sumerian heritage and Holy Arch may well be an Egyptian title It looks to me as if the later Jewish custodians hammered the circle of the zodiac into the straight lines of the Tree of Life and included their own sacred words but without being so bold as to remove the earlier words. As far as I can see the triple grip is the most ancient component. Post #15909 lauderdalelauderdale Posted 28/11/2009 08:44 Excellent Master Group: Forum Members Last Login: 04/07/2010 12:56 Posts: 2,238, Visits: 4,269 . Unfortunately, they dropped the second holy word, that I considered very important from a esoteric point of view, I would have liked to be exalted with the original ritual, but they told me that this wasn't possible.Bro Cuthbert, some Constitutions still use both words in HRA. I agree with you that it should not have been tampered with. Indeed it is a deep degree and some people will find much more in it than others as is the case in all of Freemasonry. Post #15919 ChrisH1ChrisH1 Posted 28/11/2009 09:42 Fellow Group: Forum Members Last Login: Yesterday @ 21:26 Posts: 236, Visits: 2,215 Hi CuthbertIf you would like to see the HRA with all the original ritual including penalties and The Explanation of the Mystical lecture in its pure form then you can always visit Jeanne d'arc Chapter in Rouen, under The GLNF which still uses all off the ritual. The Chapter mets in March and may for ceremonial work and Sept for Installation.The original Mystical lecture is in my opinion one of the most beautiful and important lectures in Freemasonry The heart of man is a sanctuary wherein nothing false, nothing weak should enter. Post #15922 sojournersojourner Posted 28/11/2009 10:27 Fellow Group: Forum Members Last Login: Today @ 15:12 Posts: 363, Visits: 1,513 Bro. Cuthbert,I was exalted prior to the ritual being hacked about with. I considered that nothing short of vandalism. I now live in Scotland where the ritual and words have been retained in full and Chapter here also includes the Mark and Passing of the Veils. I also have old rituals of the ceremony when Passing of the Veils was still part of the ritual in England. It is a lovely degree and I wish you many years of happy involvement. Roy L."SELUME PROFERRE" Post #15925 whistlerwhistler Posted 29/11/2009 01:29 Apprentice Group: Forum Members Last Login: 20/07/2010 08:48 Posts: 71, Visits: 304 one of Neville Cryer's books on the HRA clearly talks of on one level of a Journey and when sitting in the Chapter - I can well imagine the gatherings he mentioned. Being a Co-mason we still have the beauty and esoterically important ritual of passing the veils - to be honest I would not be happy sitting in an HRA chapter with companions who haven't been through the veils. In the process of exaltation into Chapter the point which the ritual is completed is just the beginning - It is my favorite degree - My questions to myself are not whose symbols are present - more why they are there and there my personal journey begins HGW Whistler Eastern order of International Co-freemasonry Auckland New Zealand "Truth All truths are Truths of Period and not truths for eternity. What has been truth for the time was and is as good as men are capable of receiving Post #15953 Russell HollandRussell Holland Posted 29/11/2009 07:00 Fellow Group: Forum Members Last Login: Today @ 11:54 Posts: 246, Visits: 1,522 I recall working the veils one night in LDH. The officer for the second veil was seated between 2 curtains each of which was about 6 feet long. She sat with her back to the wall looking out between the curtains down the length of the room. After the candidate had passed through and the lodge closed, she got lost. She was unable to make her way out from between the curtains. It was like she was in another world from perhaps 30 seconds. Then she regained her perception of the physical world and walked out from the curtains. Perhaps the working of the veils was real on that night Post #15954 dpdp Posted 29/11/2009 08:26 Past Master Group: Forum Members Last Login: Today @ 11:26 Posts: 903, Visits: 2,597 Russell Holland (29/11/2009)I recall working the veils one night in LDH. The officer for the second veil was seated between 2 curtains each of which was about 6 feet long.She sat with her back to the wall looking out between the curtains down the length of the room. After the candidate had passed through and the lodge closed, she got lost. She was unable to make her way out from between the curtains. It was like she was in another world from perhaps 30 seconds. Then she regained her perception of the physical world and walked out from the curtains.Perhaps the working of the veils was real on that nightThat wasn't the same poor old dear that forgot how to knock was it?I too think it is... unfortunate that the ritual was altered the way it was. Perhaps with regard to the word that was dropped it would have been better to educate the Companions on it's nature than to drop it...A great book to read is "The ensigns of the twelve tribes of Israel" by Harry Mendoza. Post #15958 3GP4413GP441 Posted 29/11/2009 13:44 Journeyman Group: Forum Members Last Login: 22/07/2010 06:11 Posts: 181, Visits: 885 Back to the OP, I have always thought the simplest message of the degree is that no matter what calamity befalls us, if we look hard enough deep under the rubble of our ruined life we can still find the presence of the divine within us and rebuild that which has been shattered. 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Bro Cuthbert, some Constitutions still use both words in HRA. I agree with you that it should not have been tampered with. Indeed it is a deep degree and some people will find much more in it than others as is the case in all of Freemasonry.
If you would like to see the HRA with all the original ritual including penalties and The Explanation of the Mystical lecture in its pure form then you can always visit Jeanne d'arc Chapter in Rouen, under The GLNF which still uses all off the ritual. The Chapter mets in March and may for ceremonial work and Sept for Installation.
The original Mystical lecture is in my opinion one of the most beautiful and important lectures in Freemasonry
The heart of man is a sanctuary wherein nothing false, nothing weak should enter.
I was exalted prior to the ritual being hacked about with. I considered that nothing short of vandalism. I now live in Scotland where the ritual and words have been retained in full and Chapter here also includes the Mark and Passing of the Veils. I also have old rituals of the ceremony when Passing of the Veils was still part of the ritual in England. It is a lovely degree and I wish you many years of happy involvement.
"SELUME PROFERRE"
That wasn't the same poor old dear that forgot how to knock was it?
I too think it is... unfortunate that the ritual was altered the way it was. Perhaps with regard to the word that was dropped it would have been better to educate the Companions on it's nature than to drop it...
A great book to read is "The ensigns of the twelve tribes of Israel" by Harry Mendoza.
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